We-ell, knowing what I know about puroresu (that's not much, however), I think that the late thriving of Pride and the decline of puroresu in general are no mere correlations. As I understand, Antonio Inoki got a lot of respect for puroresu by promoting it as a legitimate fighting art, fighting boxers and judokas and the like.
His late groups (UFO, Inoki International) and the use of men like Fujita in New Japan indicate they got the same idea. In my opinion, New Japan made a mistake when they considered wrestling to be a 'self-runner' once it was established by Inoki. Maybe instead of running wild with NWO angles they should have continued to book their wrestlers against martial arts competition. And doesn't Pride's success in Japan and UFC's failure (perhaps it's too hard to call it that, but they're not exactly getting dump trucks full of cash rolling in either) in the US prove the vital difference between American and Japanese fans? Japanese want to see hardworking and legitimate fights. Americans want to be entertained. Not a generalisation, not saying there aren't members of the other group on each side, but an observation of majority behavior. Feel free to argue anyone.
I couldn't find anything that I completely disagree with, but let me point out that New Japan kept booking some mixed matches even during the nWo/Team 2000 days. They just didn't push those matches much.
Here's my guess. Inoki is frustrated with New Japan becoming more like "sports entertainment". He is the top(? or second or third if Sagawa Express and/or TV Asahi still own more stocks than he does) stockholder, but I don't think he's involved in a daily operation.
Recently, former NJ senior referee Peter Takahashi published a book that totally breaks kayfabe. I haven't read it yet, but I heard it was nothing like the book Satoru Sayama was said to write back in mid '80s. Takahashi really did it this time. With the popularity of the MMA events and exposure of the behind-the-scene stuff of puroresu, there can be even bigger gap between MMA and puroresu from now on. That can lead puroresu to become more like sports entertainment. Who can do better in sports entertainment than WWF? They are now trying to expand into Japanese market, and some people even believe that WWF paid Takahashi to write a book only to break kayfabe so that they can "educate" the fans that pro-wrestling is nothing but an entertainemt with no seriousness needed. I believe Inoki sees the crisis in puroresu and wants New Japan to keep the "fighting" element (shoot or work) that it used to have.
okay, I didn't know that part. But I think there's a preassumption of a lot of people talking about people from the wrestling business as if they were traitors saying they're not protecting the business and breaking kayfabe etc. I think that's one of the screwiest ideas ever. No-one ever has a problem with tell-all books from the showbiz. In wrestling, people get upset. why? because wrestling needs kayfabe. But what exactly do these men owe wrestling? can anyone owe something to a concept, a thing, a business? After all these people jeopardize their health and come out losing. few of em ever get to make a better livestyle, such as the WWF Superstars. Instead, they cripple themselves for little to no money. And that's not just the hardcore population. Several wrestlers fell victim to piledrivers, powerbombs and suplexes. After all, how can wrestling expect these people to sit still and do what they're told. even if you cut out the wrestlers and take referees like takahashi, where's the point? these people thrive for money, fame etc and I really don't see why they shouldn't be sacrificing a few principles for their own good. The only thing anyone should respect are other people, not ideas.
In my honest opinion, I feel that American Wrestling was severly damaged when they started revealing it as a work. Sure everyone knew it was a work, but the angles and storylines, the wrestlers and workers, they all made you want to belive it so bad that you actually did. Much of what the wwf does is a cancer to the wrestling business. But I know that someday, the sleeping giant that is the NWA will rule again. But only after the McMahon family circus has disgusted the rest of its fans, and its talented roster seeks greener, less cartoony pastures. It may seem unlikely now, but the day will come
I agree whole-heartedly with you, Highpriest. WWF is a cancer. Don't get me wrong. I still catch RAWs, Smackdowns, and some PPVs since it is still entertaining and my only regular outlet for wrestling(and I use the word "wrestling" loosely). WWF is about product, about making entertainment and getting ratings. To do this they have to attract a large, mainstream audience, an audience that may consider themselves wrestling fans, but would find no interest in puroresu, lucha libre, independent wrestling, etc. I feel like I'm part of a very small minority that gets smaller and smaller as the real wrestling gets lost among the "sports entertainment". I apologize for the rant, but Highpriest brought up a fine point here.
Oh, and a big thanks to Hisa for giving my "minority" a means of having a voice
Agreed...its great to have a forum to discuss alternatives to the WWF. I will forever be a fan of NWA Wrestling and Puroresu. But the wwf turned the "sport of kings" into the "entertainment of mature audiences" lol.
Recently, former NJ senior referee Peter Takahashi published a book that totally breaks kayfabe. I haven't read it yet, but I heard it was nothing like the book Satoru Sayama was said to write back in mid '80s. Takahashi really did it this time. With the popularity of the MMA events and exposure of the behind-the-scene stuff of puroresu, there can be even bigger gap between MMA and puroresu from now on. That can lead puroresu to become more like sports entertainment. Who can do better in sports entertainment than WWF? They are now trying to expand into Japanese market, and some people even believe that WWF paid Takahashi to write a book only to break kayfabe so that they can "educate" the fans that pro-wrestling is nothing but an entertainemt with no seriousness needed. I believe Inoki sees the crisis in puroresu and wants New Japan to keep the "fighting" element (shoot or work) that it used to have.
I never actually sat down and thought of it in the way. I think it is refreshing to see the whole debate about Inoki-ism from a different perspective
I've only just seen some material from UWFi, but I think it (and Battlarts) was about the best possible combination of wrestling and MMA. Unfortunately, Inoki's habit of just tossing a good wrestler into a MMA match proves only that Inoki is a really bad match maker. Throwing shooters into wrestling just discredits wrestling, as the shooters don't seem inclined to work the match as a wrestler, they just go in there and kick the hell out of their opponent.
Another, not totally dissimilar example would be how Bill Goldberg was used in WCW. He just plowed right into his opponents and, naturally, won every time. His winning streak (and all those 30 second squashes of established wrestlers) did nothing but show how fake wrestling is. It made everyone look bad. Goldberg showed very little ability to work a match, and everyone else just looked like chumps because this rookie beat them in less than a minute.
Unless you have guys like Takada, Severn or Shamrock, I'd never mix the two sports. If the WWF had taken the Inoki route to using shooters, the WWF title would probably be locked up in a on-going feud between Ken Shamrock & Dan Severn, as no one else there would've been able to credibly challenge the title.
Mixed martial artists just don't make good wrestlers without a LOT of training. Wrestlers don't make good shoot fighters without a lot of training.
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