Is Puroresu Dieing???!!!!

[pigman]

I read in PWI magazine (the issue was state of the industry or something like that) and I read that puroresu just isn't as popular as it used to be. The 90's were the best years for it and it said that it has just gone completly down since then. I don't know about them but I still like puroresu.

[Kinnikuman131]

I dont think its dieing, out here were its not really well known interms of household names and stuff, when the owner of a near by pizza joint holds a thing were he shows puroresu on tv in japan, alot of people show up, way more then the party room can hold. I try to watch it more then american stuff, though im kinda picky cuz i watch osaka pro mainly.

[stunning_grover]

Wrestling died when Giant Baba died (January 1999).

[Black_Flag_Of_Ulster]

i think 'puroresu is dieting' would be more appropiate.

[Tradewynd]

First and foremost, the word is dying. If you're going to misspell something, at least misspell something above a second grade reading level.

The business as a whole is not on the brink of death. Joshi certainly is. Zenjo is $30 million in debt. Looking at attendance figures, it doesn't look like anyone is really drawing good houses. I'm glad Ayako is at least going to get a few good paydays in HUSTLE.

Zero-One doesn't seem to be doing too well either. DG is clearly kicking their rear ends. Having Sasaki and the AWA Title didn't even sell out a small building. They have a lot of talented workers, but no one who is a strong draw on top, and you need someone who draws on top to bring in the casual fans. If they were to close up shop someone could get a lot better instantly by adding Tanaka, Otani, Corino and others to pad the upper midcard.

New Japan is a company I fear for greatly. They have been terrible to TV-ASAHI over the last year, and if they keep it up for another year NJ could find themselves without TV coverage. Wrestling TV shows have the same kind of stigma in Japan that they do in America, so if NJ loses that TV deal, they're not going to get another one. NJ theoretically makes money by drawing huge houses at dome shows, which clearly has not been the case of late. It would not be surprising if the last Osaka and Tokyo Dome shows both lost US$1million+. Chono pushing himself is killing Tenzan and Nagata, and it's not too far down the line that they're going to need Tenzan and Nagata to make the next generation of guys. Shibata seems to have common sense on the surface, but then again he's loyal to Inoki. There is no way this company is making millions of dollars as Kusama claims. They are one big screwup from losing their TV deal, and if they lose their TV deal they are finished(especially since TV-ASAHI pays a good chunk of the boys' salaries).

All Japan seems to be stable for the time being. They're not booming, but all things considered, they could be, and have been, a lot worse off.

NOAH is doing just fine for right now. Except in Kobe, because Kobe is Dragon's Gate country. In a few years they're going to start running out of guys on top due to age and guys simply not drawing on top anymore. Since they don't seem to want to open a dojo signing Shibata to a long term deal should be a top priority. Misawa is going to have to do something, because KENTA and Marufuji won't be sex symbols forever and will never draw as GHC Champion.

Dragon's Gate has the ladies. And male strippers. And a stalker.

DDT probably doesn't make much money, assuming they make any, but it's a lot of fun.

Wrestling is a cyclical business but not because it goes up and down on its own. The business goes down when people screw it up with bad booking, old guys play political games and not putting over the next generation, not pushing the right guys, not making news stars when they need to be made, having Sgt. Slaughter sell out to Iraq, etc. Business booms when new stars who captivate the audience come along and are combined with good booking. Sadly, superstars like Rock, Hogan, Inoki, Rikidozan, etc. don't grow on trees, so until the people decide who that next mega star is going to be you need to a book a product good enough to keep the casual fans interested and ready to get all of their nonfan friends watching when the next mainstream star breaks out.

If nothing else, take solace in knowing that long after Suwama flops, after Kusama's "money making" ventures bankrupt the yakuza, after Omori can't sell out a garage, after all of the old guys retire in NOAH, after Dragon's Gate runs out of Ultimo students to abuse for very low pay there will still be one last glimmer of professional wrestling. That diamond in the rough that will exist no matter how long the sands of time may flow. That my friends, is HUSTLE. Since it is being funded with MMA money Captain HUSTLE will be fighting the good fight against the Generalissimo long after the word puroresu ceases to exist.

[naterob2003]

Well i tend to think that once 2 companies became 4 thats when wrestling started to die. I think with time that could all change but someone has to step up and do the right thing and quit all of this competition. Competition is usually the seed that plants greatness but too much competition can ruin the whole bunch. Can anyone here honestly imagine if new japan and zero one were together and all japan and noah were together? We wouldn't be having this conversation in my mind. With the likes of kobashi, mutoh, kawada, misawa, omori, hase, vader, and takayama and taue on top and morshima, rikio, kea, akiyama, and kojima coming up and then not to mention the suwama's and shiosaki's. Then over in new japan you have chono, hashimoto, sasaki, tenryu, ogawa, nagata, tenzan, ohtani, nishimura, and nakanishi and then the likes of nakamura, tanahashi, sato, and shibata coming up the ranks? Its amazing how different things would be. I tend to think that wrestling did kind of die with baba's passing but i do have hope that the future can only bring good. As trade said, new talent, better booking, and better money management will only help the puroresu community.

[Kinnikuman131]

Hows osaka pro doing money wise, you hadnt said anything about them.

[Daishikaze]

I think Men's Puroresu will survive some way or another, I'm not too worried about that unless they become as fractured as the Joshi scene.

Joshi is dying though,and that really depresses me, because Japan is the only country were women's wrestling got a fair deal, everywhere else in the world it has turned into a T&A fest. I don't see any way of saving Joshi, too many companies, not enough fans or talent to go around. I doubt even consolidation would save it now since most of the good young workers are either injured or retired. there is really no money in it anymore, so no real financial incentives for young girls to become pro wrestlers now, and even if their were there is no one to draw them in anymore.

[pigman]

All I read in a PWI magazine is that it is no where near as popular as it was in the 90's and every since then it has gone down in business and in popularity. And also I know it is spelled Dying. By the time I knew I mispelled it I had already clicked on Submit Reply so sorry if I offended anybody by mispelling

[Tradewynd]

Please...please don't use PWI as though it were an accurate source of information. Another idiot around here has been doing that of late and you don't want to be associated with him. If anything in PWI is true, it is a coincidence or painfully obvious.

Sure, the business isn't as hot as it was in the 90s. There are a lot of reasons for that, most of which we've talked about extensively on the forums.

Osaka Pro does not run regularly enough to really matter. They book HUSTLE guys, so I've got no complaints against them. But considering the scope of their operations, they would have to pull a Zenjo to lose tons of money. They're not in a position to make or lose enough to really matter. Although, if they tried I'm sure I would be surprised at how much they could lose if they tried.

[One to Remember]

Well HARDY HAR HAR Tradewynd. In my defense I'd like to say PWI trys. How can they cover companies who barely come here anyways? Pigman pay no attention to Wyndy for she never provides solutions or even exuses.


Its not easy. Like I like to say NOTHING is as hot as it was in the '90s. I'm the only guy in my community who still watched wrestling after the "attitude era" and boy is that frustrating. Its like mainstrwam anime. If your still watching when your older chances are your only one of the few thats old at all. Meaning wrestling is like a kid's show which really I don't like. Now again I MUST STRESS that a TOUR OF EUROPE and SOUTH KOREA could be successful if deals with the right satelite companies are estblished to showcase your promoa. and you ATLEAST try to operate onan international scale. LIKE IVE SAID BEFORE the companies in Japan are a bitabove ECW LEVEL. ECW level is an important thing a promoter should know about. If your able to get to ECW's status circa 1997& '99 and are not to badly in debt then you have a pretty good chance. If Puroresu feds were willing to meet the fans in S. Korea, Europe, Mexico, Puerto Rico, Europe, Australia, New Zealand, Taiwan, and South Africa and Singapore then they might not be on their last legs. The key to survival is not to sell out crowds but to have back up just in case. If the Puro feds could just get a fan base or try selling out crowds abroad wouldnt be so dangerous.That was WWA(All-Stars)'s problem. Advance ticket sale flops via abscurity.Now I look at the title histories of Japanese promotions and I see the same towns over and over again. Tokyo, Yokahoma, Tokyo, Yokahoma. There just isnt enough room for 'em all and the fan base is streched. Because that problems on a national scale I would call that an ominous sign.

[Kinnikuman131]

Osaka Pro does not run regularly enough to really matter. They book HUSTLE guys, so I've got no complaints against them. But considering the scope of their operations, they would have to pull a Zenjo to lose tons of money. They're not in a position to make or lose enough to really matter. Although, if they tried I'm sure I would be surprised at how much they could lose if they tried.

Im not sure how to take that answer. No prob though thanks for an answer anyway.

[Daishikaze]

OTR, Puro companies don't tour the US or Europe because its really expensive to run shows in foreign markets. They can't get a TV deal because most networks don't think that it will do well enough. Wrestling in the US is not taken seriously enough so no one really wants to take the chance. Here in Europe wrestling isn't very big at all, in fact where I live you have to have Teleclub or Direct Tv just to watch the WWE(which I wouldn't anyway).

If NJPW (or any other company) wanted to run shows in the US, it would cost them way too much money, more money than they would probably make, just because most people in the US aren't going to pay to watch a wrestling show where they can't understand what people are saying. They have money, but it would be suicide to try and break into an unfamiliar market that Vinny Mac already has a monopoly on.

At best they would have to work in tandem with an American company, TNA is out, they aren't doing so well themselves, and WWE is definately out, because we all know how selfish Vince is.

[pigman]

Listen tradewynd I'm sorry if I offended you but thats what the magazine says. I was just trying to be nice. But if you have a problem with it I can take you on any day of the week. Your not even tough enough to hold my jock.

[Black_Flag_Of_Ulster]

Listen tradewynd I'm sorry if I offended you but thats what the magazine says. I was just trying to be nice. But if you have a problem with it I can take you on any day of the week. Your not even tough enough to hold my jock.

aw, pillow fight!